Warpgate Placement, Range, and Alignment

Preferred Warpgate Features


  • Total voters
    6

Burnside

Master endo
Joined
Aug 23, 2019
Messages
308
#1
Given Lauri's most recent statement on the direction of warpgates as they enter the design phase, I have thoughts and questions relating to their deployment.

First, one-gate "accelerators" seem to be off the board for the time being; I'd been expecting to chain several of these together to create a supply highway to build the other end of a more advanced two-gate pair. Kind of disappointed we won't have that linear utility and have to rely on the super-big, hard-to-set-up stuff from the start. Second, Lauri's base range appears to be 5,000km, expectations had been, to my recollection, that tier-one gates would be limited to several hundred kilometers at best and later tiers would be used to build such super-massive highways. While on the scale of millions of kilometers, 5Mm doesn't sound like much, for traveling around the belt or to the moons, it's pretty significant especially for "short-range" intrabelt travel. Lastly, I'm curious as to how gate-pairs will be aligned to each other and how the hyperlane they create will function if the alignment is really bad, as well as how any alignment assist the gates might have will function if you build multiple gates into a single station or if that will make them impossible to use in such a way. The following are suggestions based on these three points and a poll is included to measure general support for each idea while discussion goes on in the thread.

*Bring back single acceleration gates: these gates can be as small as 20m wide and have a power cost based on their width (and thus the width of the hyperlane), the speed boost, and their falloff range, and have a startup power drain of ~20x the energy required to maintain the hyperlane to prevent its abuse as a ship-mounted system; with the speed boost dropping along a gradient by 50% with each increment of the falloff range dropping straight to zero at the end of the fourth falloff increment (i.e. falloff = 10km; 0km-10km = 100%, 10km-20km = 100-50%, 20km-30km = 50-25%, 30km-40km = 25-12.5%, 40km+ = 0%)
*Tier One warpgate pairs should have a short range of about ~500km (I prefer lower), meant for creating basic highway chains and linking together economic zones; higher tiers would have a longer maximum range to correspond with a much larger size and power cost, shorter highways would be better suited to the one-gate "acceleration gates", creating "back roads" and small long-distance supply hyperlanes for constructing the larger hypergate pairs
*Warpgates should have some manner of alignment assistance to aim the sending gate in the desired direction and create a hologram/blueprint of the receiving gate at the desired distance for ease of location and allowing the easy construction of "warp hubs" built around a series of outbound gates with their returning pairs built off the frames of the naturally-aligned receiving gates; this feature would also allow the easy replacement of a destroyed gate so long as its pairmate was still intact
 
Last edited:

AlexiyOne

Well-known endo
Joined
Feb 3, 2020
Messages
85
#2
Given Lauri's most recent statement on the direction of warpgates as they enter the design phase, I have thoughts and questions relating to their deployment.

First, one-gate "accelerators" seem to be off the board for the time being; I'd been expecting to chain several of these together to create a supply highway to build to other end of a more advanced two-gate pair. Kind of disappointed we won't have that linear utility and have to rely on the super-big, hard-to-set-up stuff from the start. Second, Lauri's base range appears to be 5,000km, expectations had been, to my recollection, that tier-one gates would be limited to several hundred kilometers at best and later tiers would be used to build such super-massive highways. While on the scale of millions of kilometers, 5Mm doesn't sound like much, for traveling around the belt or to the moons, it's pretty significant especially for "short-range" intrabelt travel. Lastly, I'm curious as to how gate-pairs will be aligned to each other and how the hyperlane they create will function if the alignment is really bad, as well as how any alignment assist the gates might have will function if you build multiple gates into a single station or if that will make them impossible to use in such a way. The following are suggestions based on these three points and a poll is included to measure general support for each idea while discussion goes on in the thread.

*Bring back single acceleration gates: these gates can be as small as 20m wide and have a power cost based on their width (and thus the width of the hyperlane), the speed boost, and their falloff range, and have a startup power drain of ~20x the energy required to maintain the hyperlane to prevent its abuse as a ship-mounted system; with the speed boost dropping along a gradient by 50% with each increment of the falloff range dropping straight to zero at the end of the fourth falloff increment (i.e. falloff = 10km; 0km-10km = 100%, 10km-20km = 100-50%, 20km-30km = 50-25%, 30km-40km = 25-12.5%, 40km+ = 0%)
*Tier One warpgate pairs should have a short range of about ~500km (I prefer lower), meant for creating basic highway chains and linking together economic zones; higher tiers would have a longer maximum range to correspond with a much larger size and power cost, shorter highways would be better suited to the one-gate "acceleration gates", creating "back roads" and small long-distance supply hyperlanes for constructing the larger hypergate pairs
*Warpgates should have some manner of alignment assistance to aim the sending gate in the desired direction and create a hologram/blueprint of the receiving gate at the desired distance for ease of location and allowing the easy construction of "warp hubs" built around a series of outbound gates with their returning pairs built off the frames of the naturally-aligned receiving gates; this feature would also allow the easy replacement of a destroyed gate so long as its pairmate was still intact
Where has Lauri posted this statement?
 

Burnside

Master endo
Joined
Aug 23, 2019
Messages
308
#3
https://discordapp.com/channels/423790999052222464/635742331315945472/676218556265791488

LauriFBLast Saturday at 18:13 space highway "warp" gates have now entered design phase, but that doesn't mean anything about production schedule yet the highway tech starts from the shorter-range, slower stuff, and expands there most likely initial highway is two linked gates working only one way, and the sender gate needs huge amounts of energy, both gates being more like medium stations the receivig end of the gate must be built by explorers going there with regular ship speed you can build two gates anywhere you like and link them just make sure the sending end gets a lot of power somehow (like a lot of solar or so) anyway, this is the general idea at the moment this highway type works for creating a highway around the asteroid belt and possibly to some nearby larger objects, but it's not suitable for building routes which are millions of km say if you want to build a 50,000 km route with 10 legs, it takes 10 hours for exploration ship to fly the one 5,000 km leg and setup the receiving end of the gate for that leg and then you use that leg to speed haul next exploration ship and materials for the next leg sending gate and so forth, maybe even a route back at some point a large faction can cover 100,000s of km's that way but not tens or hundreds of millions so for longer distances a new sort of tech is required (in-game that is)
 

Amos.37

Veteran endo
Joined
Aug 22, 2019
Messages
154
#5
Burnside, it sounds like, in a nut shell, you want to be able to set up the equivalent of travel lanes from Freelancer, a space highway if you will.
While I don't disagree, I'd like something like that to be possible, I don't think that the warp gates should function like that.
Warp gates should be for long range travel, like several thousand+ km distances between them with limitations as to how many can be built close to each other. Otherwise travel time is effectively eliminated as a logistical factor.

Some form of drive accelerator or nav relay system that speeds up ships without added structural stresses could be an idea for intermediate distances, such as between stations within the same general area (within 300-1000km), but would need to be done in such a way that they couldn't be abused to just create a constant speed boost.

For this kind of thing, I think an accelerator gate would work well. Have a gate at the station you leave, a gate at the station you arrive at, and potentially several along the route depending on the distance. How much a boost they give you would need to be carefully balanced, so that travel time is still significant, but not so long that players get bored on long haul trips.
Much like driving a car on a highway with no turns, if you just point your ship in a direction, hit accelerate and then wait 30+ min before needing to do anything again, it get's really boring.

I also agree that accelerator gates should need a greater power supply than a ship can produce, requiring either entire small stations, or a sizable area dedicated from a megastation to maintain. This would also mean that for long routes requiring multiple gates, multiple relay stations would need to be set up to complete the route.

This means that there would be potential for hub and relay stations where gate routes intersect, creating new commerce and strategic zones.

On a side note, a significant technical issue for an accelerator gate system, or any means of travelling faster than the current speed limit excluding warp/teleportation, how is stress calculated upon entering/exiting the lanes, and more importantly, what happens if a collision occurs, either if two ships both on the lane collide, or if someone flew into the lane?
(Personally, I'd totally build a giant fly swat positioned in the lane just to see what happens)
 

Caddrel

Learned-to-turn-off-magboots endo
Joined
Feb 15, 2020
Messages
46
#6
I like the approach they're taking. Without wanting to say the obvious; designing the fast transport system is one of the most important parts of the game, as it will have a decisive effect on the player experience and the economy, to name just two elements.

I have a few questions that may spur ideas, or may already have been thought of and answered:

* Will there be any travel time for ships inside the gates?
* Is the energy use per ship, or a constant drain for the entire gate?
* Will ships of all sizes and configurations be able to use warp gates? They could be limited by size, equipment. You might need a larger gate for ships, or smaller ships might have to piggyback.

I like the concept of allowing players to gradually build up infrastructure, and infrastructure varying between a well-travelled route and a backwater trail. They might have it so popular routes would require a "highway" warp gate while other destinations must just need a "gravel track" warpgate.
 

Burnside

Master endo
Joined
Aug 23, 2019
Messages
308
#7
Point 1: to my knowledge gates still use the hyperlane concept, which creates a tunnel of lowered physics or something that allows ships to break the speed cap and mitigate drag, keeping the ship inside the universe, so hyperlanes can be interdicted and ambushed and set up the need to police them for debris and pirates. I like this concept and dislike methods that move ships through non-game space or cause teleportation and remove those risks and gameplay elements. EDIT: if for physics reasons this doesn't work and ships need to move through non-game space while in a hyperlane, I'd still like to see militaries, rebels, and ne'er-do-wells have the ability to put things in the hyperlane's "path" to obstruct travel and pull travelers back into gamespace.

Point 2: no idea, I'd like to think gates have a large startup cost in power and then have to be maintained while the hyperlane is functioning, but ships operate freely within it and the gate doesn't suffer any kind of mass load on its power drain, which fits with the idea that the gates just create funky-physics corridors in space, the mass moving through them doesn't really matter.

Point 3: again, no idea, but I'd like to see gates tiered by gate aperture (size), distance, and the physics mitigation, tiers by size of gate seem the most logical with upgrade and enhancer parts (with associated increases in power drain) attached to the gate to tier the distance and speed qualities.
 
Joined
Feb 25, 2020
Messages
6
#8
My take on warp lane gates is that they would muliply the ship's effective velocity inside the warp tunnel by some factor that would be higher for larger, longer-ranged gates, but inside the warp tunnel, the apparent velocity would be no higher than normal.
 

AlexiyOne

Well-known endo
Joined
Feb 3, 2020
Messages
85
#9
I would like for ships though to have an internal warp gate that requires incredible amount of energy meaning only large ships would have this
 
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