Maps, nation alerts, and repair halls.

Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
3
#1
I'm posting to share some thought into the expansion of upcoming/current features intended to improve the Starbase experience.

MAPS
As we've been told we'll be getting a new 3d universe map which looks totally awesome. However certain features of a map like pings, and markers can detract from starbase's already unique style of navigation, More specifically in situations that involves PVP. A 3d fully detailed and traversable map is a very powerful tool in a game like Starbase, I hope that it'll be given reasonable limitations. One quick example is that it'll bypass the use of transponders thus further eliminating the potential for dynamic and organic encounters.

My main point on this was I think that it would be nice if organizations had their own map databases AKA the orgs map is the master map, and every person's map is synced to it. All discovered POI's are updated to the Org master map, which are then updated to all the org's players. Once a player leaves an org, their map is reset. Once they join an org, their map is synced to whatever is on the Org map. This would also put more stock and authenticity into orgs, making them more meaningful.

NATION ALERTS
It's been common knowledge for a while now that we'd eventually be able to 'claim' areas of space, and that these claimed areas will alert owners of 'enemy' presence.
Naturally, every player/organization wants to claim their own area for legitimacy, but most importantly safety and passive incomes of either credits or ore.
While this claimed area isn't actually a safezone, it will be making nation owners aware of any unintended visitors. I have some thoughts on how this could be implemented in a way that isn't just some magical bell that rings on a persons screen, but in a way that is gamified and works as something that feels natural/believable relevant to the game world.


First off, the implementation of a physical object (assuming limited to 1 per org) that has the capability of scanning and revealing objects in nation space. You could even expand this to revealing ore composition of asteroids, and locations of such etc. Furthermore, the means to also depict the direction of the signal relative to the scanner object. For instance, splitting the directions into a cuboid of 8 sectors. This will also require some UI work, whether the information is available on a panel (preferable) or just a panel in the players UI.

Next thing is the way that the detection works. Adding some rules into how the detector functions for instance, it can only detect objects that are generating power (not stored power), ontop of that it distinguishes the object based on its transponder status. Same org/allied transponders return a friendly signal, non org/allied transponder return an unfriendly signal, and constructs with no transponders attached return an unknown object signal.

At a glance you might think this is just some ruse to make pirating easier, but its just to further develop and mold essentially game-changing features into the landscape of a gamified world.

REPAIR HALLS
I can't argue against the huge convenience that the ship repair system provides, however I strongly believe that while making things so much easier, it's actually subtracting from the starbase experience. This might probably be a very unpopular opinion, but there are very real implications of these easy to access repair halls.

First off, its almost entirely removed in-world construction and repair gameplay. I used to do this myself a lot, and it was actually quite fun. There even used to be people advertising themselves as ship repairers in the early days.

Ship repair halls drastically change the way ships are designed. This I believe is absolutely true. Gone are the days of making ships 'sensible', in a way. This is ESPECIALLY true with fighters, which are a very big part of starbase gameplay and design. Meta's can get incredibly lame at the mercy of poor mechanics, and exploitable conveniences, of which the repair hall is at the very top of.

For the convenience they provide, the gameplay cost is too high. It influences ship design in a bad way, it impacts PVP negatively, and it can also have negative impact on future pvp oriented features such as siege. It's removed not just a part of the game, but also part of starbase's identity. I used to love trying my best to make things easy to access/repair, but now its just 'tech engineering' crap of smushing and exploiting everything together with all the ridiculous and needless extra complexity that heatsinks provide.

I sincerely believe that repair halls need to be reigned in like it's literally a bull in a china shop. I don't believe they should disappear completely, but they need to be a real privilege. For its incredibly attractive convenience, it costs the game TOO much.

SPECIAL SEGMENT - F*@% HEATSINKS
Heatsinks are trash. The previous system was miles better. Heatsinks are added complexity for no tangible reason. Literally, none. Especially since now apparently Lauri decided to discontinue the idea of heat mechanics. Good, DELETE HEATSINKS. The added complexity further hampers in world repair/building increasing the need for cheap gameplay copouts like repair halls. As for combat, heatsinks remove gameplay. You used to have to manage your weapons heat levels. Now every ship can shoot until the mags are dry because no sensible person would allow their fighters to have poor heatsink systems.

The old system consisted of compact cooling cells, which needed to be replaced by hand, or a larger coolant system, which offered care free cooling at the expense of it failing when damaged. This, was such a beautiful system, Both had pros and cons, both had their uses. Simple, non complex options. Chef's kiss, I loved it. Unfortunately now cells are completely useless as they run out super quick, and radiators are the only system you use, and every ship needs heatsinks regardless. So, you've removed options from ship design, added a new NECESSARY system, that provides no benefits. Even if it did provide benefits, you removed a cooling system that had variety, and replaced it with "every ship needs a heatsink now hurr durr because it doesn't already have enough useless weight aboard".

So heatsinks literally, do nothing. Actually this isn't true, they subtract from the Starbase experience. I'm sure you guys would be really hesitant to revert this thinking "too much work went into it". Unfortunately it has to happen. Now that heatsinks don't have a future for expansion (which it needed anyway to justify its pitiful existance) the time for removal is NOW. Heatsinks add needless complexity. Heatsinks remove pvp gameplay experience. Heatsinks are BASTIUM BOXES FROM HELL EXORCISE IMMEDIATELY. I hate heatsinks and their useless contribution to Starbase.

Thank you for reading.
 
Last edited:

ZombieMouse

Well-known endo
Joined
Oct 12, 2021
Messages
59
#2
Once they join an org, their map is synced to whatever is on the Org map. This would also put more stock and authenticity into orgs, making them more meaningful.
This would need to be integrated with the permissions system with ranks. Since I would expect a lot of orgs would not want to grant every new rando access to everything.

Gone are the days of making ships 'sensible', in a way.
I did love the need to build ships in a player-accessible way also. But large ships were tedious to refuel. Then we got large generators, but no way to refuel them, and hence repair-refuel became the norm. What would be needed is in-world refuelling of large generators, to bridge the gap for large ships.

The old system consisted of compact cooling cells, which needed to be replaced by hand, or a larger coolant system, which offered care free cooling at the expense of it failing when damaged. This, was such a beautiful system
I even went as far as building self-sealing radiators that knew when they were damaged, which I thought was cool. But I think the problem was that a lot of players didn't know what was wrong when radiators leaked out and couldn't fix their ships. So we got this system instead. I doubt they will go back.
 

Askannon

Veteran endo
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
125
#3
Heatsinks are added complexity for no tangible reason
Heat was invisible in the game, so to figure out why something didn't work when it was in fact overheating was difficult. At least the new system has allowances so that even when there is no other dissipation, it allows for low amounts of production.
Also, I can make some points: complexity so that having generators run on low power can actually matter beyond just extended fuel economy, since they need less heatsinks and can deal with that one buffed radiator.
Especially since now apparently Lauri decided to discontinue the idea of heat mechanics
I think that one was more aimed at heat mechanics for the purpose of sensing, since the question he answered to was "will the map be used for heat mechanics?" with "warp and other pings will replace heat mechanics".
added a new NECESSARY system
Heatsinks are far less necessary than you'd think, since now you actually don't need any dissipation at all.
Not a good way of going about things, but each and every device has heat dissipation now. You can't say that of the previous system, where you're screwed if you have no cooling at all.
And heatsinks are just buffed devices in terms of heat properties. 10x storage, 10x passive dissipation, 10x push to radiator. That doesn't sound like a necessary part at all unless you want to make a performant ship by saving weight on parts.
Additionally they provide a way for people to check where in the power system the issue lies: not enough radiators? Heat gets stored in them then other devices.
Connection issues? you can check if they have transferrate.
None of the above? Needs more power production
So they have a function of being a simple analysis point. One the previous system didn't have, since it could be a damaged pipe, drained coolant cell or, my favourite, no power to run the radiators.

Just trying to point out that heatsinks and the related upgrades are both a simplification for operation and a complication for design.
Though I wouldn't be against a buff to cooling cells
 
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