Ship Shop Ships

Should Ship Designers Receive benefits/protections?


  • Total voters
    42

Kodey

Veteran endo
Joined
Jun 13, 2020
Messages
193
#1
Recently, there was a leak involving someone reselling "perfect" replicas of ship shop ships, and this has brought up some concerns.
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For me, the biggest concern is how this person is making 2mill credits from OUR designs, yet ship shop designers get literally nothing. I can't help but feel like I'm being spit at when I see this happening. However, another concern was raised when people began to look at bolt patterns on the ships. They, oddly enough, seem to be exactly the same


This post was made mostly to bring attention to (possible) ship BP theft, but also how ship designers can get ****** by people like this. FB, at least give us a cool cosmetic/award. We do this for free, and it hurts to see our blueprints (possibly) stolen and resold for a higher price while we get nothing.
 

Kodey

Veteran endo
Joined
Jun 13, 2020
Messages
193
#4
Would be great if the Devs release the BP system sooner than later.
Atleast stops s**ms from boasting about better skill when things are stolen.
Yeah, hurts to see stuff like that when you make your stuff nearly open source.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2021
Messages
16
#6
So, there are now talks about a guy slapping on a debugger and dumping them from memory.
Will this have a dev response or should we consider adding a debugger to our gameplay loops as acceptable practice ? I really love to debug things too!
 

Mutleyx

Veteran endo
Joined
May 22, 2020
Messages
146
#7
I think it's pretty clear these are not replicas, they are hacked blueprints. As Kodey says, the bolting pattern points to that, but even that aside, it takes hundreds of hours to make some of these ships, the game has not been out long enough from someone to create this many copies of existing designs.

I'm hoping FB comes out wielding the ban hammer, to serve as a warning to others, because this behaviour is not acceptable!
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2021
Messages
2
#9
I have only recently been playing since Early access. I think its so strange that the designers of these ships arent getting royalties for players buying these ships in game because thats what i thought was happening when i first started. I didnt realise either, that you cant update the ships even though you designed them because i remember thinking why spend so much money when its outdated.

The repair tool drives me insane. All my ships i have purchased have been vouchered and revouchered because i cannot repair and the only solution was by purchasing the parts and installing them in again. Painstakingly slow.

During this process I ended up wanting to re-plate my purchased ship in better material. Ended up just making a bp copy of the ship. I just figured thats what this guy did aswel. However the bolt patterns is very interesting indeed.


I dont know if i would try and sell off the bp of the ship, but i most likely would share it with company members. May i ask though as i recognise some of the people in the replies, would you sell your ships from the past and currently, in sss? and if not then why since you dont get anything from ingame shops?
 

*FS*

Well-known endo
Joined
Jun 16, 2020
Messages
79
#10
If this player isnt already banned for doing this I'll be finding a new space game to play/cover
Yeah man one of my friends has brought 2 of your ships from the shop after being shot down in pvp zone. I know they (Dev's) have BAN HAMMER players for trying to sell credits for real money and this is kinda of the same deal even though they are in game credits.

Recently, there was a leak involving someone reselling "perfect" replicas of ship shop ships, and this has brought up some concerns.
Thx u for posting this. I had one player say to me if i wanted a blueprint because i like the car ship and after some thought i figured that they must be messing with game files which i refuse to do.
 
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Kodey

Veteran endo
Joined
Jun 13, 2020
Messages
193
#11
There is a very simple solution:
The devs add a certificat in the BP when you create the ship (hide unique tag in creative mode)

5% of the construction costs are donated to the creator at each build of the ship by the BP, even modified

BP can then be public without risk
I'd love to see something like this! With this, I could make my blueprints open and actually profit from it
 
Joined
Jun 30, 2021
Messages
2
#12
If i am allowed to quote another game, Then something like what we used to have on Dual Universe is good for the BP - The owner/creator name gets tagged on the BP & has the rights to give out copies - aka one time usage prints / Locked & Unlimited - Cannot edit the ship but can make more copies for sale at showrooms & shops / Open BP - Editable and can be made into copies.

This would give the security needed for the Creators who spend days, if not weeks making something good.
 

Womble

Veteran endo
Joined
Jun 11, 2021
Messages
177
#13
This highlights a couple of things.

There's at least a subset of the population that would love to have, rather than a spawned ship, a bloop of a shopship that they really like but isn't perfect, quite, for their needs, that they could tweak in the designer, either for something like colour or upgraded materials/Tier components without having to manually replace everything in "the real world".

The ship shop creators deserve in-game remuneration. I think the eventual intent is to phase out the current ship shops and have their replacements be a place where the seller gets at least a piece of the financial action.
 

Norway174

Active endo
Joined
Apr 12, 2020
Messages
44
#15
Frankly, I think we should do away with this type of blueprint system. The whole thing feels like it creates more problems and drama than its worth.

I think when you buy a ship, you should gain the full rights to it. It's yours, you paid for it. Take it into the designer, update & modify it. And make all the copies you want.

If this is something the designer doesn't want; Then don't sell the ship. And don't take it outside the safe-zone if you're not willing to risk it getting captured.

Once a ship is captured, the capturer then gets the full rights to it. To do whatever they want with it. (However, the blueprint should be saved in the state it was in when captured. So if you capture half a ship, then you've only got the blueprint to half a ship.)


Look at games like Space Engineers, and Stormworks, and Empyrion, and StarMade, and Avorion... Can you imagine if those ships at the Workshop were paid? That'd be ridiculous.

Now, before you yell at me for this being an MMO. The core concept of those games are the same as here. You grind for resources, to get bigger and better ships and bases.

And those people still hours, weeks, and sometimes even months in those games creating those ships. Then why is the people who do the same in StarBase should get special treatment?

People are gonna start doing it for the incentive, and not because they love it. And it's gonna become a business. And less of a game. Just look at Second Life community vs. Skyrim community.

Second Life is so cold and heartless. And those creators aren't playing a game as much as they're running a business.
While in the Skyrim community, it's more open and helpful and welcoming.


Now, that's not saying ship designers don't deserve any rights. They absolutely do. But at some point, their liberty has to end. So ours can begin.

I am aware Starbase is supposed to have this whole ship trading economy system to it. Like "Oh you could buy that famous ship that was in that war and flown by that pilot" or whatever... Yeah... I don't really see that ever working. I can't think of any games where that is a thing.

Only other game I can think that even attempts that would be Star Citizen. But so far, they've only added the ship naming system. (Which is a whole other can of worms of a bad idea regarding how they did it. Like this whole unique name idea is utter BS.)

And even once Star Citizen is further along, I have my serious doubt it's ever going to work the way it was advertised.

I know personally, I don't give a flying carp about the history of a ship, and who flew it during what. It just doesn't work in a game where it just doesn't matter. :p

EVE is probably a good example for this as well; No one's gonna buy a Kestrel that was flown during the Fountain Wars for anything more than the standard buying price.


TLDR:
A ship is a ship. And once you have it, it's yours. And blueprints should only function as a repair guide. Not as a locking mechanism. And any blueprint of a ship can be saved / updated at any time in a designer if you own the ship.

So, a practical example;
You buy a ship off someone. Take it the designer, make some modifications. Save the modifications to the ship. And save a local blueprint so you can load it later.

So now, the repair guide will reflect the modifications when repairing the ship.


PS: I'm not defending the act of stealing those BPs, and selling them. But I think it was inevitable for it happen, and it's gonna happen again. Just more hidden the next time, if FB cracks down on it.
 

FLMNAG

Learned-to-sprint endo
Joined
Aug 26, 2021
Messages
21
#17
No, the original certificate cannot be replaced in my vision of things.
The only way to change this value is to create a new file.

except you can just copy pasta to a new file and bam there goes your 5%

That way, if someone changes and commercializes your BP, it’s still you who earns 5%

Add a value linked to the user ID in the file it’s not the end of the world for devs...
And it’s much easier to charge by the assembly cost.

Anyone can hack the plan, they’ll pay you anyway!
 
Last edited:

Kenetor

Master endo
Joined
Aug 9, 2019
Messages
336
#18
sadly its easier said then done, another way around it would be to make the ship a module and paste to another file too,
once your in the designer, the parts are just objects, the only way of tagging ID would be through the file, and no way of knowing which configuration of parts is one ID or another
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2021
Messages
2
#19
The only way I can think off how they did it is by testing the flight in the ship shop and ripping that fbe file that is downloaded. If FB can change that it should make it safer. I dont think they can rip it from memory unless the clients send fbe files to eachother when players meet. If that´s true then we are all screwed...
 

Agonarch

Active endo
Joined
Aug 10, 2021
Messages
42
#20
Hahaha, I too would like my imaginary ownership of my ship's blueprint ship design the EULA specifically denied.
Hang on a sec, you're arguing that you should have more right to use a blueprint stolen from the game than the people that made it do to keep it?

How would the start of the game have been for you without those ship-shop ships? Not showing a lot of gratefulness for them sharing their ships (supposed to be securely) or even empathy here.
 
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