Who would like to see/participate/bet on SPACE RACES?

five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#1
An idea that has come to me lately is: What about racing in starbase?
Other space games already have this implemented with dedicated space craft (SC) and other games have custom maps and vehicles for this (SE). So why not also have it in Starbase?
You would set up a track with markings and people would build space craft under a special ruleset:
1. The ship has to have x amount of Box Thrusters and or triangle thrusters
2. No weapons (Ship and personal)
3. Maximum of x maneuver thrusters
4. Can be max. x long, y tall and z wide
5. No YOLOL automation work and or sensory work
6. Only basic FCU

with a ruleset for the track and the race itself.
I think it would be fun and it would greatly help the development of newer and faster spacecraft as it has in real life.
What would you think about it?

Your curious fella, five
 
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five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#2
You would have a course of rings being lighted and fly through this course: Either you make a really long course and do it so that u have to complete the course once, or you make it a smaller course and the pilots are supposed to fly rounds. The race rule set would be:
After a qualifying run (Everybody flies the fastest time they can in 3 tries, this ensures that: 1. The pilots know the track, 2. Everybody gets the chance to oneup themselves)
After the qualifying you will get your starting position. Since we can think in 3 dimensions the pilots are going to start in a double helix (like a DNA).
The one helix contains all the odd numbers (Starting positions 1, 3, 5, 7 and 9) and the other helix contains all the even numbers (2,4,6,8 and 10). Though i am not certain of this system with the double helix you could also make it work in the same way with a single helix with the starting positions 1 - 10 every position 90 degrees rotated from the last and a bit further back, as to have an advantage over other pilots at the start.
Rules during the race would be:
1. No skipping rings
2. No intentional ramming
3. No braking to get others to ram into you
4. Don't push players into the barriers
Violation of these rules will lead to disqualification. Compliance with the rules will be secured by personell watching the race on the rings and a following/camera ship for recording. If a crash happens (which given the rules should only happen on accident by the pilots own fault or another pilots fault) The race is stopped. While the race is stopped the racing crew of the crashed pilots are allowed to change the ship, so the race can be continued. Debri will be removed. The pilot that caused the accident will be moved back 3 places and if he is in last he can choose to either quit the race or receive a 1 second penalty. After everything is ready again the race will continue with everybody in their positions after 5 second countdown (Somebody with a 1 second penalty has to wait an extra second.
 
Joined
Jul 6, 2020
Messages
11
#3
I like the idea of sanctioned races like this, however I would make a few adjustments.

1) Do not limit the amount of thrusters to a set number. Manufacturers should be allowed to have as many as they want for competitive freedom. They will establish a meta at some point between weight, thrusters, and fuel which will be valuable information when they make ships for other applications requiring speed. Make a maximum ship mass so people have to work within it. Having 20 thrusters may take up too much ship weight and too much fuel so it will self balance.

2) Ramming should be allowed. They will all be travelling in the same direction, so head on collisions would be unlikely, which makes straight griefing more difficult. It does, however, make the races more interesting to watch and participate in and adds another level to the race where the participants need to be careful about other ships and the structural integrity of their own ship. Ships built with the ramming tactic in mind would result in two outcomes: the first being they will either exceed size/weight requirements and be disqualified or they will be too slow to catch up with the other ships and compete. The second outcome is it is very effective and everybody begins to make fast and strong ships to bash each other, which results in good research for real space applications.

3) If a ship falls apart, it is disqualified.

4) I like the rest of your ideas. Limit maneuver thrusters so it doesn't become a crazy collection of ships with 80 thrusters on them. Keep all the other system simple - no YOLOL, no advanced or premium FCU, etc.
 

five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#4
I like the idea of sanctioned races like this, however I would make a few adjustments.

1) Do not limit the amount of thrusters to a set number. Manufacturers should be allowed to have as many as they want for competitive freedom. They will establish a meta at some point between weight, thrusters, and fuel which will be valuable information when they make ships for other applications requiring speed. Make a maximum ship mass so people have to work within it. Having 20 thrusters may take up too much ship weight and too much fuel so it will self balance.

2) Ramming should be allowed. They will all be travelling in the same direction, so head on collisions would be unlikely, which makes straight griefing more difficult. It does, however, make the races more interesting to watch and participate in and adds another level to the race where the participants need to be careful about other ships and the structural integrity of their own ship. Ships built with the ramming tactic in mind would result in two outcomes: the first being they will either exceed size/weight requirements and be disqualified or they will be too slow to catch up with the other ships and compete. The second outcome is it is very effective and everybody begins to make fast and strong ships to bash each other, which results in good research for real space applications.

3) If a ship falls apart, it is disqualified.

4) I like the rest of your ideas. Limit maneuver thrusters so it doesn't become a crazy collection of ships with 80 thrusters on them. Keep all the other system simple - no YOLOL, no advanced or premium FCU, etc.
Point 1: Really good idea since at some point you could find the ultimate balance between weight and thrust but as far as I know rn there is no way to tell how much a ship weighs exactly

Point 2: I understand your point: It would make it more exciting, but my idea was to make it less of a demo derby and more like other racing series like formula 1 or the german touring car series. I think it would be interesting how people would evolve maneuvers to overtake other ships. This rule was less to look at how stable for ramming you can make your ship but more to challenge the pilots to fly at the game engines limits, just millimeters away from crashing into a ring as they steer in a extrem way to overtake their foe. Though I would not have problem if there would be a demo derby like racing series

Point 3: There would be a pre check where everything would be checked: Compliance with the rules and stability of the air craft. There is the stability tool which tells you if something is wrong with your frame or how you bolted smth. to your ship. If its not 100% good you are not allowed to participate

Point 4: Thank you very much
 

CalenLoki

Master endo
Joined
Aug 9, 2019
Messages
593
#5
I'm for as few unnecessary rules as possible.
I.e. why only basic FCU? It's hard enough to efficiently utilise strafing movement with keyboard control.
Limit on manoeuvring thrusters won't be needed. Even with low limit, you have more chance of over-steering than under-steering.
You can soft-limit size by building the track in specific way: obstacles, narrow corridors, small rings.

The meta will develop over time. If it turns out to be boring (i.e. everyone doing the same thing) then start thinking about more rules.

I'm also for ramming. But that could be different each event.
 
Joined
Jul 6, 2020
Messages
11
#6
I'm for as few unnecessary rules as possible.
I.e. why only basic FCU? It's hard enough to efficiently utilise strafing movement with keyboard control.
Limit on manoeuvring thrusters won't be needed. Even with low limit, you have more chance of over-steering than under-steering.
You can soft-limit size by building the track in specific way: obstacles, narrow corridors, small rings.

The meta will develop over time. If it turns out to be boring (i.e. everyone doing the same thing) then start thinking about more rules.

I'm also for ramming. But that could be different each event.
I agree with the basic FCU because it forces people to make ships that require pilot skill. This results in more research going into making flyable ships with less expensive components and adds a tad bit more of pilot skill into the races. Later, these ships can be adapted for normal use with better FCUs and stuff.
 

XenoCow

Master endo
Joined
Dec 10, 2019
Messages
319
#7
I like the idea of races. I think that would be a great place for engineers to work with pilots to design the best ships possible while also providing a respite from fighting and helping to bolster the economy.

I agree with five that crashing should be something to avoid. Like real races, it is exciting when it happens, but is not the goal or helpful for the racers involved in the collision.

One addition I would like to see is some sort of limit on fuel or coolant. This could then facilitate pit stops with fast crews or extra engineering to design quick automated systems.

I agree with the basic FCU because it forces people to make ships that require pilot skill.
The FCU doesn't make flying any easier, it just opens up new control dimensions (strafe, up/down, backwards) without YOLOL.
 

Verbatos

Veteran endo
Joined
Aug 9, 2019
Messages
170
#8
I'd say just limit the rules down to:
- Stay on >>specified track<<
- No weapons
- Mass limit
- Ramming allowed

It would be cool to see races develop more around a pilot's ability to maneuver precisely than their speed, so ship races could be fast-paced with tight turns, something like those drone videos you see online where someone pilots their little drone around abandoned buildings and such at high speeds. Since there is a speed cap having pilots rely solely on speed would just create a "whoever hits fly first" type of race.

Also, I think YOLOL is no problem, mostly because of how slow it's reaction speed is, fast maneuvers would be too much for it.
I'd also say that you can use any FCU you want since they allow for more control over a pilot's ship, which would be important with the tight, precise races I am proposing.
 

kiiyo

Well-known endo
Joined
Jul 11, 2020
Messages
57
#10
Oh. Me and my friend already made a racing company, the IGRA. We'll be organising our first race soon so it's good to see there's an audience. I'll post on this thread once we get the rules of the first race done, so anyone from here can either join the race or at the very least watch it.
 

five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#11
I like the idea of races. I think that would be a great place for engineers to work with pilots to design the best ships possible while also providing a respite from fighting and helping to bolster the economy.

I agree with five that crashing should be something to avoid. Like real races, it is exciting when it happens, but is not the goal or helpful for the racers involved in the collision.

One addition I would like to see is some sort of limit on fuel or coolant. This could then facilitate pit stops with fast crews or extra engineering to design quick automated systems.


The FCU doesn't make flying any easier, it just opens up new control dimensions (strafe, up/down, backwards) without YOLOL.
I like the limitation of fuel, because it would also passively reduce the amount of thrusters used. With coolant, restricting it and pushing people to do "pit-stops" would only be able with coolant cells. Though I don't know if people would rather use batteries or generators. And lastly about FCUs: I wanna keep it basic since all the others make it a cheese fest. I want you to fly the best route you can with only pitch or yaw, because with strafing you could fly much tighter curves, but you could make several racing series one restricted to a basic fcu and one where you can use every FCU
 

five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#12
I'd say just limit the rules down to:
- Stay on >>specified track<<
- No weapons
- Mass limit
- Ramming allowed

It would be cool to see races develop more around a pilot's ability to maneuver precisely than their speed, so ship races could be fast-paced with tight turns, something like those drone videos you see online where someone pilots their little drone around abandoned buildings and such at high speeds. Since there is a speed cap having pilots rely solely on speed would just create a "whoever hits fly first" type of race.

Also, I think YOLOL is no problem, mostly because of how slow it's reaction speed is, fast maneuvers would be too much for it.
I'd also say that you can use any FCU you want since they allow for more control over a pilot's ship, which would be important with the tight, precise races I am proposing.
Again I propose splitting it up into several racing series
 

five

Master endo
Joined
Jun 15, 2020
Messages
260
#13
A racing station would be awesome to see built. Would be cool to see this become reality
There is already a plan for building the halo rings around eos. Maybe you could make a lemans/isle of man/daytona 500 kinda race around the halo rings
 
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