The downfall of Starbase
- Thread starter Quevin
- Start date
I see people talk about radiation sensor and all that stuff, but I can't see how they will be able to implement that over a P2P network. This would mean EVERYONE would have to be pinged within your sensor range far outside of render range, might lead to real performance issues.
They would probably need a dedicated server to handle that kind of thing on its own.
They would probably need a dedicated server to handle that kind of thing on its own.
A little idea for this feature if it gets implemented that the asteroids can respawn proportionate for each player that is online, for example, asteroids respawn in clusters every few hours, multiple clusters in the SZ if there are a lot of players in that specific one, or more frequently but clusters will be a little ways away and pretty spread out from the station to encourage the acquisition of a better ship or the upgrade of the current one.
Honestly the best and right to point response right here. Not only that but some of the complaining seemed like a person not interested in a space game than anything to do with negative aspects of STARBASE. By no means is SB perfect but my gawd the game is not even in Early Access yet and the man's complaining as if this is a full release like Elite Dangerous. At least those folks over there have good reasons to complain about FDev's constant missteps.
I did not have the chance to participate to the closed alpha. I was intending to dive into early access asap.
But honestly after reading this I will be more conservative, wait and see how it evolves.
Lot of problems I see here are alpha related and usual in such stage. No problem.
But to see already at this stage the developer is taking an aggressive stance on PVP community is a cold shower to me.
It is sad to see nowadays carebears community is winning every lobbying war in new mmo games. New World? PVP slider. Elite Dangerous? PVP slider. etc. What dev should understand is that those choice kills their game before it's even born. When Forbes talks about Eve Online it's not to say how great it is to mine for 100h on a row. It's not to talk about PVE activiity. It's to describe big organizations fighting to control certain areas. It's to talk how one organization backstabbed another with black ops.
I am really scared when I read the developer wants to forbid social engineering. My god. This is typically one of the most interesting part of large scale MMO. How on earth is it possible to want to remove this from a MMO PVP game?! This raises to me question on whether the developer actually played any PVP MMO in their life.
I will wait and see. Quite sad actually I was excited to try this game on 17th of June. I thought "hell, finally a real PVP MMO in space". But apparently it's not PVP.
But honestly after reading this I will be more conservative, wait and see how it evolves.
Lot of problems I see here are alpha related and usual in such stage. No problem.
But to see already at this stage the developer is taking an aggressive stance on PVP community is a cold shower to me.
It is sad to see nowadays carebears community is winning every lobbying war in new mmo games. New World? PVP slider. Elite Dangerous? PVP slider. etc. What dev should understand is that those choice kills their game before it's even born. When Forbes talks about Eve Online it's not to say how great it is to mine for 100h on a row. It's not to talk about PVE activiity. It's to describe big organizations fighting to control certain areas. It's to talk how one organization backstabbed another with black ops.
I am really scared when I read the developer wants to forbid social engineering. My god. This is typically one of the most interesting part of large scale MMO. How on earth is it possible to want to remove this from a MMO PVP game?! This raises to me question on whether the developer actually played any PVP MMO in their life.
I will wait and see. Quite sad actually I was excited to try this game on 17th of June. I thought "hell, finally a real PVP MMO in space". But apparently it's not PVP.
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You're going way ahead to try and compare Eve to this, this is not Eve and will never be.
But lets talk about Eve and that example you used is to generate publicity. The PVP community in eve is a drop in the bucket compared to the PVE numbers. Eve had a long time to get to that stage, Starbase is not even released yet lol. So calm down and keep your money if you want, its a P2P spaceship building game at its core, closest comparison is space engineers.
If you want intensive PVP MMO there's Black Dessert and Albion Online, or even back to Eve lol, you might enjoy those.
But lets talk about Eve and that example you used is to generate publicity. The PVP community in eve is a drop in the bucket compared to the PVE numbers. Eve had a long time to get to that stage, Starbase is not even released yet lol. So calm down and keep your money if you want, its a P2P spaceship building game at its core, closest comparison is space engineers.
If you want intensive PVP MMO there's Black Dessert and Albion Online, or even back to Eve lol, you might enjoy those.
Yes but in EVE 20% PVP players generate 80% of world events. Without them, the game would not be so rich. And EVE's system gives space to PVE only players to operate. They don't access end-game content obviously but they can evolve through a lot of gameplay loops. Which makes all sides happy.
I know it's an alpha, as I said. But what matters at this stage is the general mindset displayed by the developer and the direction it seems to be willing to set for their game. If the direction is like other recent MMOs with a "staged" PVP scene where everything has to be based on mutual consent (call it any sort of slider), I think the game is not going to last very long.
Of course I might be jumping over conclusions too fast, that's why I'll give it a closer look.
I know it's an alpha, as I said. But what matters at this stage is the general mindset displayed by the developer and the direction it seems to be willing to set for their game. If the direction is like other recent MMOs with a "staged" PVP scene where everything has to be based on mutual consent (call it any sort of slider), I think the game is not going to last very long.
Of course I might be jumping over conclusions too fast, that's why I'll give it a closer look.
i aint worried about the population at all. if you have ever been on discord and looked around the faction channel you would know a few things like, Collective has 653 members online right now with a roster of 1183, Voodoo Shipping Company has 633 online and 1,354 members, Tactical has 537 online with 1,603 members. There are also several more with that member size waiting on EA, this is not including the 2 dozen other factions with 300-500+ members waiting. The dev factions while not as many as the ones i name, they too are well stocked with members waiting for EA. And the thousands of other players who haven't committed to any faction yet.
there is no way in hell i am missing this party come june 17th!
there is no way in hell i am missing this party come june 17th!
I get what you're saying but the way the game is designed can't really emulate that, there simply isn't enough game loops to please most of the population.
But lets me try to make the point another way, its like looking at a candy company and expecting them to fail if they don't produce as much for diabetic consumers. Sure they may have options for the diabetics, but the main pull is the sugary taste for the majority non-diabetics.
MMO only survive if there's a massive population, in MMO scene, PVE players dominate, hence why MMO's have gone in this direction. The only successful PVP MMO's I've seen are the heavily pay to win ones, a la Black Desert and other Korean games.
But lets me try to make the point another way, its like looking at a candy company and expecting them to fail if they don't produce as much for diabetic consumers. Sure they may have options for the diabetics, but the main pull is the sugary taste for the majority non-diabetics.
MMO only survive if there's a massive population, in MMO scene, PVE players dominate, hence why MMO's have gone in this direction. The only successful PVP MMO's I've seen are the heavily pay to win ones, a la Black Desert and other Korean games.
ive also noticed a big switch in pvp games moving strongly towards sandbox games. the most inventive pvp has been in the recent years more dedicated in suvival/craft games. i think a lot of that has to do with a less linear movement of the same old same. When you play a normal mmo game, the pvp ends up kind of flat because there is such a large seperation between pve and pvp.
But survival MMO Sandbox PvP does really well, and i think two of the reasons being 1) much less linear, and 2) your forced to accept both sides of the game even as a pvper only. The things you need to excel in pvp comes from actually playing the game. WoW is a good example, in the new WoW expansions, you can fully dive into pvp and never really have to leave any city, completely cut off from the rest of the world. In classic WoW upto Wrath, you were forced out into the world to pvp and your gains came from participating in the pvp/pve aspects. What is hurting WoW today is a huge seperation.
Starbase combines them both together, you want a ship to pvp? then you need to go farm a ship, build a ship, or make credits somehow to buy a ship. same with future endo armors, and current weapons, none of this is just given to you it will have to be earned in the universe in some fashion(material, credits, etc.). Ark survival same way, you want to PvP, well you better level your crafting through PvE or your gonna be fighting with sticks and rocks while they have guns.
But survival MMO Sandbox PvP does really well, and i think two of the reasons being 1) much less linear, and 2) your forced to accept both sides of the game even as a pvper only. The things you need to excel in pvp comes from actually playing the game. WoW is a good example, in the new WoW expansions, you can fully dive into pvp and never really have to leave any city, completely cut off from the rest of the world. In classic WoW upto Wrath, you were forced out into the world to pvp and your gains came from participating in the pvp/pve aspects. What is hurting WoW today is a huge seperation.
Starbase combines them both together, you want a ship to pvp? then you need to go farm a ship, build a ship, or make credits somehow to buy a ship. same with future endo armors, and current weapons, none of this is just given to you it will have to be earned in the universe in some fashion(material, credits, etc.). Ark survival same way, you want to PvP, well you better level your crafting through PvE or your gonna be fighting with sticks and rocks while they have guns.
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were talking about the online aspect of the game, cause the ship building is really fun and enjoyable for people who likes doing that, but if you dont you were out of luck, there is basically nothing to do other than desing ship and participate in "scripted" events. But ship building is not part of the community and player interaction part of the game (if someone says you can talk to other people about ship building and you can share desing i swear to god i will slap them because it is not in-game interaction) and thats what people are mostly debating about
That's all Starbase has to offer for the foreseeable future though. There's lots theorycrafting and talking about features/interactions in Starbase that does not exist yet which leads people to expect that there is currently more to the game aside from MMO Space Engineers, technically you can shoot other people with your ships but most of the PVE community won't outside of scripted events. The current game is probably good enough to pull that playerbase and do it well, its a fairly safe bet for success.
I can't stress this enough, the game seems to be designed with shipbuilding first and foremost, everything else seems to be slated to fall in around that.
The game simply cannot be PVP intensive/focused, if it wanted to go that route, there would be no ship building and balance would have been a bigger priority. You would be naive to think you could be on top of balancing PVP where the players have pretty much complete control of construct design, there will be near cheat levels of builds for PVP that will make it dumb. Developers cannot foresee every possible "emergent" gameplay with this much freedom.
That said, lacking NPCs, PVP has to be there for the ships to have any substance and the scripted events gives you the option to do stuff and things with them other than mining. NPCs would be nice but oh well.
I can't stress this enough, the game seems to be designed with shipbuilding first and foremost, everything else seems to be slated to fall in around that.
The game simply cannot be PVP intensive/focused, if it wanted to go that route, there would be no ship building and balance would have been a bigger priority. You would be naive to think you could be on top of balancing PVP where the players have pretty much complete control of construct design, there will be near cheat levels of builds for PVP that will make it dumb. Developers cannot foresee every possible "emergent" gameplay with this much freedom.
That said, lacking NPCs, PVP has to be there for the ships to have any substance and the scripted events gives you the option to do stuff and things with them other than mining. NPCs would be nice but oh well.
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PvP is definitely a focus. However, its a complex setup in SB. Which I find to be awesome. We are missing many tools. Not just for PvP players, but the PvE as well. Which is fine. Thats the stage we're at.
Also, its clear to me, that this is supposed to have a symbiotic relationship between PvP and PvE players. It doesn't always have to be a fight. It never had to be to begin with.
Also, its clear to me, that this is supposed to have a symbiotic relationship between PvP and PvE players. It doesn't always have to be a fight. It never had to be to begin with.